Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

While talking with non veggies we get a lot of questions. This forum is to finding the best answers to those questions.
KingFisher9
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Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby KingFisher9 » Feb 12, 2006 10:23 pm

A cow needs to be milked in order to live why don't you drink it?

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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby Sergio » Feb 14, 2006 6:11 pm

KingFisher9 wrote:A cow needs to be milked in order to live why don't you drink it?

Because calf need that milk.

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Postby KingFisher9 » Feb 14, 2006 10:46 pm

Right, but I'm sure that the milk industry doesn't just let the calf die. If the calf die they loose money and starving a calf is against the law. So the milk that is on the market is not needed by the calf

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Postby Sergio » Feb 14, 2006 11:44 pm

KingFisher9 wrote:Right, but I'm sure that the milk industry doesn't just let the calf die. If the calf die they loose money and starving a calf is against the law. So the milk that is on the market is not needed by the calf

The same milk is not needed by the humans, so it certainly can be given to the calf :)

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Postby KingFisher9 » Feb 14, 2006 11:52 pm

Sergio wrote:
KingFisher9 wrote:Right, but I'm sure that the milk industry doesn't just let the calf die. If the calf die they loose money and starving a calf is against the law. So the milk that is on the market is not needed by the calf

The same milk is not needed by the humans, so it certainly can be given to the calf :)


Humans don't need cloth or cars or the internet or forums. Lets give that away to animals as well.

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Postby Sergio » Feb 15, 2006 8:49 am

KingFisher9 wrote:
Sergio wrote:
KingFisher9 wrote:Right, but I'm sure that the milk industry doesn't just let the calf die. If the calf die they loose money and starving a calf is against the law. So the milk that is on the market is not needed by the calf

The same milk is not needed by the humans, so it certainly can be given to the calf :)


Humans don't need cloth or cars or the internet or forums. Lets give that away to animals as well.


You start first :)

But seriously, what is corelation between leaving cow their own children and giving animals forums and Internet?

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Postby KingFisher9 » Feb 15, 2006 9:14 am

Sergio wrote:
KingFisher9 wrote:
Sergio wrote:
KingFisher9 wrote:Right, but I'm sure that the milk industry doesn't just let the calf die. If the calf die they loose money and starving a calf is against the law. So the milk that is on the market is not needed by the calf

The same milk is not needed by the humans, so it certainly can be given to the calf :)


Humans don't need cloth or cars or the internet or forums. Lets give that away to animals as well.


You start first :)

But seriously, what is corelation between leaving cow their own children and giving animals forums and Internet?


Well, you said that the reason you don't drink milk is because the humans don't need it, but there are a lot of things that humans don't need. Including the internet and computers. So if you are going to give up milk because you don't need it why don't you give up everything else that you don't need?

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Postby Sergio » Feb 15, 2006 3:17 pm

KingFisher9 wrote:
Sergio wrote:
KingFisher9 wrote:
Sergio wrote:
KingFisher9 wrote:But seriously, what is corelation between leaving cow their own children and giving animals forums and Internet?

Well, you said that the reason you don't drink milk is because the humans don't need it, but there are a lot of things that humans don't need. Including the internet and computers. So if you are going to give up milk because you don't need it why don't you give up everything else that you don't need?

It's because cow need her children to drink that milk much more than Internet and forums.

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Postby KingFisher9 » Feb 15, 2006 4:59 pm

Sergio wrote:
KingFisher9 wrote:
Sergio wrote:But seriously, what is corelation between leaving cow their own children and giving animals forums and Internet?

Well, you said that the reason you don't drink milk is because the humans don't need it, but there are a lot of things that humans don't need. Including the internet and computers. So if you are going to give up milk because you don't need it why don't you give up everything else that you don't need?

It's because cow need her children to drink that milk much more than Internet and forums.


This is where I diagree because like I said earlier the milk industry would not let a calf starve to death.

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Postby Sergio » Feb 15, 2006 11:04 pm

KingFisher9 wrote:[skip]
This is where I diagree because like I said earlier the milk industry would not let a calf starve to death.

But they will kill almost all male calfs as soon as they have enough weight and by buying meat you support those killings.

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Postby KingFisher9 » Feb 15, 2006 11:07 pm

Sergio wrote:
KingFisher9 wrote:[skip]
This is where I diagree because like I said earlier the milk industry would not let a calf starve to death.

But they will kill almost all male calfs as soon as they have enough weight and by buying meat you support those killings.


I thought we were talking about milk?

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Postby Sergio » Feb 15, 2006 11:20 pm

KingFisher9 wrote:
Sergio wrote:
KingFisher9 wrote:[skip]
This is where I diagree because like I said earlier the milk industry would not let a calf starve to death.

But they will kill almost all male calfs as soon as they have enough weight and by buying meat you support those killings.


I thought we were talking about milk?

Yes, about why we don't drink it. And it's why we don't drink it, to not support cruel industries.

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Milk and Dairy Products

Postby girbey » Mar 3, 2006 11:36 am

This reply is a bit long but please read the whole thing. It tells you a lot about milk and dairy. These are the reasons I don't drink or eat it. I hope it helps you understand that humans are not meant to drink cow’s milk for health reasons and for ethical reasons.

The dairy industry actually supports the veal industry. Most of the female calves are now going to be slaves to the dairy industry and some may be used for veal. As for the males they are used for veal since they have no need for them in the dairy industry. From the day they are born they are kept chained and in tiny quarters so they will have minimum movement. At six weeks of age they are taken to the slaughterhouse so they can become a someones meal. :cry:

Cow’s milk can lead to many health problems. First of all there is a huge difference in Human milk and in cow’s milk. Human milk is only 5%-7% protein and cow’s milk in 15 percent% protein. Casein is the main type of protein found in cow’s milk. It has 20 times more casein than human milk does; this makes the protein from cow’s milk almost impossible to assimilate.

Animal products and other sources of high protein are very acidic, and the blood stream must balance this acidic condition by absorbing alkaline minerals such as calcium from the bone structure. Therefore as your body is trying to assimilate the protein in the cow’s milk it is actually pulling calcium out of your bones to do this. Many people believe that cow’s the best way to get calcium. This is not true. The best way to add calcium to your diet is to eat more fresh green vegetables. Cow's milk is high in calcium; the problem is that it is in a form that cannot be assimilated very well by humans.

Allergies are another problem. When this protein cannot be properly broken down, it weakens the immune system, causing allergies and many other problems. Symptoms of this allergic reaction to cow's milk in infants can include asthma, nasal congestion, skin rash, chest infections, irritability and fatigue.

Another serious problem caused by consumption of cow's milk is iron-deficiency anemia 15 to 20 percent of children under age 2 in the U.S. suffer from iron-deficiency anemia. Cow's milk contributes to this condition in two ways. First cow's milk is extremely low in iron, containing less than 1 milligram of iron per quart. It is estimated that a 1-year-old would need to drink 24 quarts of cow's milk a day to meet his iron requirements, which would be impossible. Infants may drink from one to two quarts of cow's milk a day, which satisfies their hunger to the point that they do no have the appetite to consume enough of other foods that do have a high iron content. The second way that cow's milk leads to iron-deficiency anemia in many infants is a form of gastrointestinal bleeding caused by increased mucus and diarrhea associated with dairy consumption. The diarrhea impairs the infant's ability to retain nutrients from his feedings. In addition, the changes produced in the gastrointestinal tract by the allergic reaction result in seepage of the child's own blood into the gut. This loss of plasma and red cells leads to a lowering of the infant's blood protein level and to the development of anemia."

The mucus created by dairy products causes other problems as well. It is well known that dairy products cause excessive mucus in the lungs, sinuses and intestines. This excess mucus in the breathing passages contributes to many respiratory problems and that mucus hardens to form a coating on the inner wall of the intestines that leads to poor absorption of nutrients, which can cause chronic fatigue. This mucus also causes constipation, which can lead to many other problems.

These are just some of the health and ethical issues associated with milk/dairy. Just a little online research can teach you a lot. Look it up you may be surprised.

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Postby AndyBa » Oct 5, 2006 12:16 pm

Read my signature.

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Why don't you eat milk or cheese

Postby mredthomas » Oct 10, 2006 9:47 pm

Genesis 1:29-31 genetics? When man or beast is killed, there's war in the 'meat'. A mother, perhaps, gives her milk freely to the child, otherwise there is vengence (uncomfortable chemistry) in it. The energy on it or around it is not peace. I drink myself to death. I'm not a cow. Vegan is paradise...unless you're around the wolf. Ppppppppppppp

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Re: Why don't you eat milk or cheese

Postby AndyBa » Oct 11, 2006 11:37 am

mredthomas wrote:Genesis 1:29-31 genetics? When man or beast is killed, there's war in the 'meat'. A mother, perhaps, gives her milk freely to the child, otherwise there is vengence (uncomfortable chemistry) in it. The energy on it or around it is not peace. I drink myself to death. I'm not a cow. Vegan is paradise...unless you're around the wolf. Ppppppppppppp

Hehe! :)
Genesis ? ;)

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Why don't you eat milk or cheese

Postby mredthomas » Oct 24, 2006 2:49 pm

Exodus...Isaiah 46:10...Victory of the Lamb :geek:

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Postby lunarflowermaiden » Feb 13, 2007 11:47 pm

I realize that this question was answered by a few people already, but I thought that I would add an interesting fact for those who are still curious about why one would choose not to consume cow's milk. I have been taking psychology and human development courses, as I am very interested in those subjects, and I was reading recently that feeding babies with cow's milk can actually contribute to SIDS. The reason being is that cow's milk is harder to digest than human milk is, and this causes the infant to be more tired and sleep more deeply than would an infant that is fed human milk. Deep sleep is strongly connected to SIDS, and research is finding that babies are much, much, better off being fed human milk, as nature intended them to. That is just an extra fact, for anyone who is interested.

KingFisher9 wrote:Right, but I'm sure that the milk industry doesn't just let the calf die. If the calf die they loose money and starving a calf is against the law. So the milk that is on the market is not needed by the calf


In most cases, the calf is taken from the mother and slaughtered to make veal, and humans consume the mother's milk that was to be for her calf. I do not drink milk that was not produced for me. That is stealing, and I find it very cruel. As for cheese, I do not consume it for dairy reasons and the fact that it contains rennet. It would be hypocritical to not eat flesh but to eat part of a calf's stomach, not to mention it is cruel and disgusting.

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Postby AndyBa » Feb 15, 2007 9:41 pm

Wow I didn't know about SIDS.
lunarflowermaiden, can you post some sources?

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Postby lunarflowermaiden » Feb 15, 2007 10:49 pm

That information was taken from what I have read in a book called "The Developing Person" by Kathleen Berger, but here are some sources that have related information:

http://www.pennhealth.com/health_info/p ... 000115.htm
http://www.askdrsears.com/html/2/T020600.asp
http://www.webmd.com/content/article/36/1728_78550.htm
http://www.babyreference.com/InfantDeaths.htm
http://www.midwiferytoday.com/articles/formula.asp

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Postby rac_box » Mar 7, 2007 10:22 pm

I don't agree. Why shouldn't we drink milk or cheese? They are some very healthy aliments, rich in Calcium. If people consume them for a few thousand years, and there wasn't any loss in cow numbers, I think that this shouldn't be a problem for anyone!

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Postby lunarflowermaiden » Mar 8, 2007 4:14 am

rac_box wrote:I don't agree. Why shouldn't we drink milk or cheese? They are some very healthy aliments, rich in Calcium. If people consume them for a few thousand years, and there wasn't any loss in cow numbers, I think that this shouldn't be a problem for anyone!


Don't assume that milk and cheese are as healthy as they are made out to be. They both contain hormones that are fed to cows. These hormones are thought to be the cause of 11 year-old girls developing much earlier than they normally would. I look at it even beyond a health aspect, though. I don't consume a cow's milk, or any other animal's milk, because it is not mine. By purchasing milk and cheese, veal factories are also being supported. That is just something that I want no part of.

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Postby BigBecka » Mar 9, 2007 4:55 pm

If people consume them for a few thousand years, and there wasn't any loss in cow numbers, I think that this shouldn't be a problem for anyone!

Dairy products have never been consumed in the vast numbers they are consumed nowadays. Cows have been selectively bred over the past few hundred years to give higher milk yield, and we still have to resort to feeding them hormones to satisfy today's market.

Traditionally, unless you lived in a dairy farming area, dairy products were expensive, luxury products, that you would eat rarely. I've heard old people still talk about cream like it's an enormous treat, and my mother goes crazy for the stuff! In many of the poorer parts of the world (Mexico, India) dairy products are still rarely consumed.

Have you ever seen a mother parted from its infant? Have you ever been forcibly parted from a baby you have just given birth to and bonded with?

In my country there are problems with nutrients being leached from the soil because farmers are farming intensively instead of rotating crops or leaving land fallow. Farming cattle is an inefficient use of land. Cows also account for a fair proportion of greenhouse gas emmissions (!) Loss of cow numbers is not the issue: it's quite the opposite!

From a health perspective, cheese and beef have been shown to imbalance some people's blood sugar levels as badly as eating refined sugar, and diabetics are being advised to avoid them. Cheese is also linked to tension headaches. Then there's the saturated fat content, the increased mucus production, the growing numbers of people who are allergic or intolerant to dairy...

These hormones are thought to be the cause of 11 year-old girls developing much earlier than they normally would.
11?! The lucky sods! :D I had breasts at nine! (My mother was part of the 'eating dairy every day - every meal most days - to prevent osteoperosis' brigade) If society won't ban dairy, they can at least start making bras for children! :protest:
Last edited by BigBecka on Mar 10, 2007 9:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby lunarflowermaiden » Mar 10, 2007 5:33 am

BigBecka wrote:
11?! The lucky sods! :D I had breasts at nine! (My mother was part of the 'eating dairy every day - every meal most days - to prevent osteoperosis' brigade) If society won't ban dairy, they can at least start making bras for children! :protest:


That is early! I'd say that I was around 11. I agree with you about bras for children. I am sure that they are on high demand thanks to dairy :lol:. My mom is the same way with milk. She worries every day if I am getting enough calcium :roll:. She used to have to beg me to drink a glass of milk (even before I went vegan). I thought that it tasted so nasty. I was a cheese junkie, though, I will admit. Do you want to know something interesting that I read the other day? Supposedly, the reason that cheese is so addicting is because of the milk derivative casein, which mimics the effects of opiate drugs, such as morphine. I guess that this is why cheese is the most difficult food to give up. I am living proof of that. I have been craving cheese more and more every day. I can't find any vegan cheese (besides Tofutti cream cheese) in my area. I have been pulling my hair out lately trying to find a vegan cheese :banghead:. Anyway, I just thought that I'd share that.

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Postby BigBecka » Mar 10, 2007 6:18 pm

Wow, I didn't realise that about casein :o - I was a total cheese junkie too, I still crave pizzas and cheese ploughman's (kind of a westcountry thing: some big chunks of the local cheddars or stiltons, with doorstep bread, hot chutney, pickled onion, maybe tomatoes or an apple, washed down with a pint of real ale or cider). :tongue8:

If it's any consolation to your mother, the British Heart Foundation and Diatetic Foundation have started recommending green vegetables (albeit as well as reduced-fat dairy) as a low-fat source of calcium. Maybe she'll find it reassuring that vegetable sources are being recognised by the medical fraternity? Check this out: www.bda.uk.com

I've tried some hard cheese subsitutes (Cheezely) which were horrible beyond comparison - most cheese cravings can be negated with a splash of oil or some kind of sauce. Even my dear Ploughman's dinners can be recreated with some olives and sundried tomatoes :D You can get a dry mix for a vegan cheese-flavoured sauce for lasagnes, etc. Otherwise, I think your body gets used to different types of food: I've actually started craving salad recently (I used to only eat salad if it was in a burger or kebab!) :D

Hmm, your studies on child development sound really interesting :) has there been a lot of research into the effects of dairy on young children? How do your lecturers and other people on your course feel about eating dairy? I have heard that a growing number of children are allergic to dairy: there was a programme on the TV about it a few months back. It's quite a problem, because a lot of processed foods aimed at children use milk derivatives.

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Postby AndyBa » Mar 11, 2007 5:18 pm

Starting from the age of 3 I believe, I'm not sure but I was still in the kindergarten. I couldn't drink cows milk already. I ate cream and cheese but pure milk was something that would make me puke.
And those bastard in the kindergarten were forcing me to drink the glass of milk during the breakfast, which I was vomiting later on the table. :lol:


Regarding the cheese crave... in my case it disappeared in a couple of months, starting from the moment when I decided not to eat cheese even on birthdays. Till then I would never buy it myself but when visiting someone, especially on birthday parties it was really difficult for me not to eat some :oops:

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Postby lunarflowermaiden » Mar 12, 2007 8:47 pm

The only information about the effects of dairy that I have read was in a chapter of our textbook about why breastfeeding is better for babies, but I have noticed that there is a LOT of research articles on the internet about the problems with dairy. Most of the people in my course agree that breastfeeding is better for babies, but I think that they still feel that children and adults should drink milk (probably because of the calcium issue). That reminds me, I will have to tell my mom about the vegetables! Thank you for that link :D.

I am almost sure that I am the only vegan in my course, but there might be others who just aren't talking about it. I also heard about children being allergic to dairy. I have noticed in my area that all of the foods containing milk must have "contains: milk" written on the back of the container or package. I used to only see warnings about peanuts. With all of the information that is coming out, I don't understand why people continue to drink and eat dairy products. It is strange, but I guess some people don't believe it or just don't care.

Andy, I felt the same way about milk. It tasted very disgusting. Did you folks over there in the UK have those little strawberry milk containers to drink with your lunch when you were younger? I remember I was always given them, and they made me want to hurl :sad8:.

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Postby BigBecka » Mar 14, 2007 7:35 pm

And those bastard in the kindergarten were forcing me to drink the glass of milk during the breakfast
Oh, I feel for you! I was never a milk fan, I could only stomach it if enough chocolate milkshake powder was added to stop it tasting like milk :lol: I was lucky though, my Mum was put on a low fat diet when I was little, so we had skimmed milk: I could never stomach semi-skimmed or full fat milk, and I used to refuse to eat milk if it had lumps of cream in :oops:

The government stopped giving milk to school children before I started going to school, but it was still subsidised, so you could buy a small carton of milk at break-time for something like 10p. I heard a few years back that a group were petitioning the government to bring back free milk for school children. And I was surprised to see a poster at my Doctor's surgery offering free milk to pregnant women. The concern is that poor families won't eat enough green vegetables to get calcium (the supermarkets mark up the price on fresh veg, so a lot of low-income families end up eating convenience foods). I don't know why they don't just promote green veg, but there you go... The nutritional education you get in UK schools is abysmal, a surprising number of people believe that milk=calcium, even last year there was a marketing campaign on the TV, and newspapers will often quote doctors who are worried that low-dairy diets will cause an "epidemic" of osteoperosis amoung women in the future. But it's starting to change, with these celebrity chefs and nutritionalists giving people a better idea of nutrition.

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Postby BigBecka » Mar 15, 2007 10:43 pm

Just saw a documentary called "50 Shocking Facts About Your Food" - The most shocking from my point of view is that it has been shown that, while it is still popular to believe that drinking milk prevents osteopeosis and brittle bones, there is now evidence to suggest that the inverse is true! :o

Unfortunetley, I didn't catch who had done the research, but I did find the attached on the web at http://www.thehealthierlife.co.uk/artic ... bones.html:
And milk just doesn’t cut it in terms of bone health: In fact, studies show it’s not the best source of calcium, the most crucial bone-health nutrient, and it doesn’t actually protect against fractures or other bone problems. Doubt was cast on the official advice to drink milk for bone health by the 12-year Nurses’ Health Study, which examined data from over 72,000 post-menopausal women in the US. It revealed that women who drank two or more glasses of milk a day had a higher risk of bone fractures than those consuming one glass a week or less. [Am J Public Health 1997; 87: 992-73]

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Postby AndyBa » Mar 17, 2007 4:03 pm

Here the situation is even worse... many people just don't care what they eat. :\ And those who care do believe that milk=calcium.

There are so many controversial researches lately...
Personally I believe that exercise isn't the last factor in having strong bones.

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Postby BigBecka » Mar 18, 2007 12:20 pm

Personally I believe that exercise isn't the last factor in having strong bones.
I think this is very true. I used to have pain in my joints a lot, and I was told it was an precursor or early form of arthritus; my mother and my doctor told me to rest a lot, and not to do high-impact exercise. When I was a teenager I got fed up with being fat and never going out, so my Dad bought me a bicycle which we repaired together, and I went out cycling nearly every day that summer, as well as going walking with my Dad. My mother was horrified, and my parents argued a lot about it. But I lost a lot of weight and the pain in my joints reduced. I started going to the gym when I was old enough, and a gym instructor noticed that I didn't walk properly (my thighs had been so fat that I sort of staggered) - he taught me to walk on a treadmill, and got me using weights, which helps strengthen your bones aswell as muscle. It was he who suggested I take up kickboxing. Now my joints hardly hurt at all, and I get to enjoy life too :D I suspect the pain was partially caused by my weight, or maybe something that I was eating... I don't know if I might get arthritus badly when I'm older, but, I'd rather be in a wheelchair at 60 than have a heart attack at 40! :lol:

Which reminds me, I need to stop surfing the net so much, and bring my bike out of the garage for summer 8)

Here the situation is even worse... many people just don't care what they eat.
That's not good :( I bet they care when they see those photos of you doing one-handed handstands :D

I know a few people who still behave like this: they seem to convince themselves that any health problems they have are genetic, or pre-ordained in some way. People often confuse a healthy life-style with extreme fad dieting and eating disorders. I even know people who consider themselves "above" being healthy, and think that they're superior to people who are healthy - they laugh at people who do exercise, are proud of their huge bellies, and order unhealthy food as if to make a point :-? I think they are sometimes jealous and insecure though :wink:

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Postby AndyBa » Mar 21, 2007 9:20 am

BigBecka wrote:I know a few people who still behave like this: they seem to convince themselves that any health problems they have are genetic, or pre-ordained in some way. People often confuse a healthy life-style with extreme fad dieting and eating disorders. I even know people who consider themselves "above" being healthy, and think that they're superior to people who are healthy - they laugh at people who do exercise, are proud of their huge bellies, and order unhealthy food as if to make a point :-? I think they are sometimes jealous and insecure though :wink:


That is so true... I so much hate when people leave their fate to their genes.
There are also those people that complain every day about how bad they feel and yet do absolutely nothing about it..

Regarding the bicycle :) Where do you usually ride it?
I went roller skating a couple of weeks ago, and the back wheel, which I usually use for braking, just broke in the middle of my skating...
imagine how i had to get back home!! :)
had no spare boots...

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Postby BigBecka » Mar 24, 2007 3:32 pm

LOL!!! :lol: I can't skate at all (no sense of balance at all!), but if I go out wearing high-heels I usually carry my trusty baseball boots in a bag for such emergencies :D Where do you skate - in the city?

Well, I don't cycle much any more. The roads around here are still narrow and windy, but there are more people living here now so there are a LOT of cars. And people aren't very bike-friendly either. So it gets pretty scary! :o Last year I started getting up early and cycling to work when the roads were still quiet, so I think I'll start doing that again now it's a bit warmer and lighter. But I REALLY want to get in shape and try some of the mountain biking trails round here - it looks so cool! Where I live now is fairly close to Exmoor, and the south coast and North Devon coastal paths. And I normally drive down to Cornwall at least once a year, which still has a lot of wild, unspoilt countryside (and surf!). I'm really lucky to live here, so I ought to make the most of it :wink:

I've just been looking at these places on Google Earth - I can't wait for the summer :glasses7:

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Postby AndyBa » Mar 26, 2007 10:35 pm

Yes in the city... but not on the roads.. drivers are quite..hm.. in a hurry around here..

I usually get to a place near a lake were I have plenty of space for skating.

....mountain biking... I've only dreamed of it :)

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Postby Red Jester » May 17, 2007 5:09 pm

rac_box wrote:I don't agree. Why shouldn't we drink milk or cheese? They are some very healthy aliments, rich in Calcium. If people consume them for a few thousand years, and there wasn't any loss in cow numbers, I think that this shouldn't be a problem for anyone!


Milk is not a good source of calcium.

It does contain a lot of calcium but it also contains a lot of protein.

Excess protein prevents your body from absorbing calcium.

Therefore, time-average, you don't get a lot of calcium.




I don't drink milk because it tastes like crap unless it's completely fresh and frigid in temperature. Both Cheese and Milk turn me into phlegm-boy.

Also, my family is a perfect example of those who consume such a diet.

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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby crashcrew1974 » Sep 9, 2007 5:20 am

KingFisher9 wrote:A cow needs to be milked in order to live why don't you drink it?


I don't drink milk or eat cheese because the cows providing it are mistreated and then brutally tortured and murdered. The same goes for eggs and honey. I do not believe that any animal or living being deserves to die or hurt in any way so that I can eat. If it doesn't have roots or isn't 100% derived from something that has roots (to include sea vegetables), I don't eat it. I also don't use any products in my home that contain any animal (or possible animal) products. Veganism is a VERY compassionate lifestyle. It can be hard sometimes in today's world, but it's a very important thing to do both compassionately and environmentally. The vegan lifestyle is worth everything that meat-eaters think that we're losing out on. I find that it's the meat-eaters that are losing out on. Come on, most don't even know their basic grains because it's just a side dish to them. Which is okay for them because that's how they like it. But for me and my fellow vegans, we choose to love all beings as we love ourselves and our house pets.

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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby meign » Sep 27, 2010 5:16 am

Sergio wrote:
KingFisher9 wrote:A cow needs to be milked in order to live why don't you drink it?

Because calf need that milk.


I agree... That's why they always say that breastfeeding is the best for babies...

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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby phoebe200309 » Dec 1, 2010 9:25 am

The following information is from peta2 in an article called 'Milk Drinkers: Try to Stomach This One!';

'Aside from the disg usting undercover investigation we launched earlier this week into a supplier for Land O' Lakes—showing farm workers kicking and electro-shocking cows too sick to stand up—what's another convincing reason to stop drinking pus, I mean milk?

The veal industry. Baby cows, because their mom's milk ends up on store shelves, are torn from their mothers hours after they're born and then kept weak and immobile in filthy pens for the entirety of their short lives. And if that fails to register your compassion or your di sgust, let's try this: Veal just might be laced with poison.

That's right—federal charges have been issued against Select Veal Foods Inc. for allegedly lacing feed with formaldehyde in order to lessen diarrhea and with potassium permanganate to ensure that the anemic calves' flesh appeared even lighter. Wayne Marcho and Select Veal Feeds are expected to plead guilty to misdemeanor charges of misbranding under the Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act. The company also faces a felony charge for lying to Food and Drug Administration inspectors.

The moral of this story? Every glass of milk you drink has a little veal in it. Not only do you contribute to the suffering of an infant, you also risk eating toxic chemicals that you'd find in your high school chemistry lab. What can you do? Try veganism today!'.

I don't think it mentions it here, but the cows are raped (with what is basically a metal rod with bull sperm in it) to produce the milk you drink - they don't make it without a calf.
When they have the calf, it is then turned into veal (see above). Then, when they are milked, the metal machines are clamped onto their udders so tightly that they produce blisters and sores. The blisters produce pus, the sores bleed, and it all falls into your glass of delicious milk! Then, when all the blood and pus is gone, they scab up, and the scabs fall in too! Yummy! :)
Then, this delicious concoction of pus, blood, and scabs is turned into cheese, butter, and everything else with dairy in it. Including chocolate :(

And don't even get me started on eggs.. haha :lol:

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AndyBa
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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby AndyBa » Dec 8, 2010 12:37 am

Thank you, phoebe200309
Unpleasant but effective article.

sable
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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby sable » Dec 8, 2010 10:36 pm

Because I hate the taste of milk. Also the female cows are being used. In order for them to have milk, don't they have to go through the process of pregnancy first and then give birth? That's kind of considered "rape." If the female cows are fed poorly and are unhealthy, they would probably have a low drive to mate. Anyway, how would after-pregnant female humans would like it if their newly-born child is taking away and only to find her milk being drained away from her breasts? Eek.

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Trev
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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby Trev » Dec 9, 2010 1:32 am

I don't eat any dairy because if that cow could speak i know his ass would be yellin' to stay away from his utters! or hers.

But seriously i don't eat dairy b/c i respect all beings and am able to get complete nutrition from all plant sources without having to burden a cow for a precious bodily resource not to mention put it through the awful and unbearable cruelty of dairy farms.

Also you can't separate the white from the red, baby male cows are killed alot of the times check out the dairy section in this pdf http://vegansociety.com/downloads/vegan ... nimals.pdf

In short, to end the suffering of cows.

The dairy industry pushes the importance of milk b/c it has calcium as a huge marketing ploy. Soymilk has just as much. So does fortified cereals and some orange juices. Dark greens are an excellent source of calcium, so are nuts and beans. If you want really strong bones practice tai chi lol, otherwise with regular exercise and proper vegan nutrition you will have wonderful bone strength. I have never been stronger in my life since going vegan, anyone who worries about lacking vitamins on a vegan diet does not know a shred about nutrition.

If you have grown up in American society then you most likely have been 'brainwashed' and bombarded your whole life by the media, parents, and doctors who may not be aware of just how much calcium you can get from non-animal sources. With a daily multivitamin it is so easy to get the daily amount of calcium.

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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby GFinCAN » Jan 13, 2011 4:41 am

To add, in many businesses (can't even call them "ranches") in the meat industry animals are pumped up with antibiotics in their food to help them deal with their awful living conditions. These are present in the meat and dairy products, and lead to antibiotic resistance in humans. Antibiotics kill the good and the bad bacteria, and the ones that survive multiply and are nearly impossible to kill off if/when necessary.

Also, think of how many lactose intolerant people are out there. Lactase is not produced in abundance in our body, and instead of people realizing that maybe milk doesn't make them feel so great, they resort to Lactaid and other dietary aid pills to help them digest this sugar that maybe we shouldn't be mass consuming in the first place. Humans are the only animal who consume milk after infancy.

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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby snog » Jan 13, 2011 11:38 am

It killed me how, on the news, during the big snowstorm we in the northeast had, that one family bemoaned the lack of milk in their home. Gee, they could eat legumes for protein, and greens for calcium. Most Americans have much food stockpiled; I doubt most of us woukd go hungry.

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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby SgtFiddlestixx » May 8, 2011 7:26 am

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Last edited by SgtFiddlestixx on Aug 9, 2013 5:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

VBryan
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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby VBryan » May 9, 2011 11:40 pm

I do not eat milk or eat cheese as these are non vegan foods.
The question in this forum should be why are you vegan essentially rather than anything this specific.
New born babies should have breast milk in the same way all other mammals who are herbivores provide milk for their new born to begin with.
Only humans in their misguided wisdom decided that regularly consuming milk as an ongoing food source in to their adult lives was a good idea it seems.

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Re:

Postby Trinity73x » Sep 17, 2011 1:14 am

KingFisher9 wrote:Right, but I'm sure that the milk industry doesn't just let the calf die. If the calf die they loose money and starving a calf is against the law. So the milk that is on the market is not needed by the calf

if the calf is a male it is sent to slaughter as and sold as veal female calves are raised until they are able to be impregnated. once they give birth the calf is taken away from them and they cry and cry until a few days later they are impregnated again. when they cannot give birth anymore they are sent to slaughter. the average cow can live 20 to 25 years. most dairy cows live about 5 years.

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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby Voids » Jan 30, 2012 11:17 am

Drinking cows milk is bizarre in itself as no other species drinks milk past the weaning stage - imagine breastfeeding someone at 30 and tell me if that's normal?
In addition to that, the milk you drink, in the natural order of things, is supposed to be of your own species.

So uh, if you're that keen on drinking milk past the point of weening, the logic thing to do would be to go have a chat to your mother and see how she feels on the subject.

Perhaps there's a little hint here about why she doesn't lactate anymore. ;)

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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby garnislitton » Feb 6, 2012 12:03 pm

Milk is very good for us but cheese certainly not for me because I am bit weight conscious.

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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby polkadotsocks » Mar 1, 2013 8:31 pm

cheese is mainly casein (milk protein) and there are evidences of casein turning on cancer in lab animals better than a carcinogen (cancer promoting components in body). This is the reason I stay clear of cheese. Also I think dairy does not sit well with me especially high fat yogurt! gives me a bad tummy ache......

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danit98765
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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby danit98765 » Apr 1, 2013 4:46 pm

In the milk industry the cow get pregnant around the clock in order to produce milk. It is not natural process. In nature the cows get pregnant only once a year. So in order to produce milk the cows in the milk industry:
1. Get separate from their calf a few hours after birth
2. Are treated for horns, which can injure the calves
3. Get marked with dry ice
4. Becoming milking machines
5. Their udders get filled with milk and it hurts them.
6. In the end they get slaughtered

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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby Merrygaity » May 11, 2013 2:01 pm

Milk is often praised as a perfect food which contains all the protein, fats and minerals that are needed for a healthy life. It is often recommended that we drink a pint of milk a day. Milk is, after all, the only food for the young of mammals. It seems natural that we should rely on it and other dairy produce manufactured from milk as a source of nutrition.
But matters are not so straightforward. Cows' milk is not a natural food for human beings. For human infants it can be harmful unless modified as it is infant formula. When Milk Is Not A Healthy Food

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Re: Why don't you drink milk or eat cheese?

Postby Judij » May 14, 2013 7:25 am

I stopped drinking milk 6 years ago. Occasionally i drink it with tea or coffee once in a six months. Yes i am not taking caffeine as well regularly. I am having Knee pain complain. I have noticed that whenever i gain the weight i have such problem.

Parents are always advising me you have stopped drinking milk thats why you knees are hurting. But as per my calculation and experience i don't believe in it.

I have started bit jogging and stretch out. It cured. I also have firm suggestion that cow milk is for calf only not for humans.


 


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