Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Talk about Animal Rights. How to protect non-human animals from being used or regarded as property by humans? Discuss ethical aspects of animal liberation activism.
WarChild
Passionated Vegan Talker
Posts: 188
Joined: Feb 25, 2006 7:13 am

Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby WarChild » Mar 28, 2007 11:20 am

I was an environmentalist back before the movement got taken over by idiots who put animal welfare above human welfare.

Jay Scott Raymond

Source: http://www.slackages.com/me/index.html

Sergio
Vegan Talk Veteran
Posts: 294
Joined: May 24, 2001 12:00 am
Contact:

Postby Sergio » Mar 31, 2007 9:51 am

If by human welfare he meant ability to destroy animal habitats for one more hamburger, allow hunting and more pollution, then he's wrong.

BigBecka
Lord of the posts
Posts: 513
Joined: Dec 2, 2006 7:53 pm

Postby BigBecka » Apr 8, 2007 12:05 pm

Not sure I like being called an idiot! :wink: If you look at the guy's website, he certainly seems to like shooting... :o

There a quite a few meat-eating environmentalists round here. Hugh Fearnley-Whittingstall (a local celebrity chef) recently spoke at a public meeting alongside Friends of the Earth, calling on the government to control the environmental and social damage caused by the large supermarkets. He advocates home cooking, using local produce. He has his own small-holding, and a TV cookery show where he features the places he buys food from, often going fishing, shooting birds or scavenging for mushrooms himself.

There seems to be a growing movement in the UK, whereby eating meat is considered OK if it's organic and local, or you catch it yourself. Whilst it's probably a lesser of evils, I think we need to challenge this :blackeye:

aoas
Vegan Talk Frequenter
Posts: 44
Joined: Sep 21, 2010 12:52 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby aoas » Sep 22, 2010 12:04 am

WarChild wrote:I was an environmentalist back before the movement got taken over by idiots who put animal welfare above human welfare.

Jay Scott Raymond

Source: http://www.slackages.com/me/index.html


The implication of what you wrote in your post is that humans should always be above animals. Anyone agreeing with that should probably have a look at the argument from marginal cases and do the tiniest bit of research into the philosophy behind animal rights and animal interest based arguments.

meign
AR Knight
Posts: 2229
Joined: Sep 15, 2010 8:55 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby meign » Sep 22, 2010 8:18 am

I think we should put human welfare and animal welfare on the same degree... Both have rights and feelings... The only difference is that human can talk and can say what we really have to say... :)

aoas
Vegan Talk Frequenter
Posts: 44
Joined: Sep 21, 2010 12:52 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby aoas » Sep 22, 2010 10:35 am

meign wrote:I think we should put human welfare and animal welfare on the same degree... Both have rights and feelings... The only difference is that human can talk and can say what we really have to say... :)


Not every human can, and animals do communicate about basic things.

What RIGHTS do you think animals should have?
And if like many people you're not sure about the word, please look it up before replying, so are you talking about legal rights, or saying that animals have 'natural' rights?
Or was that the wrong word to use.

meign
AR Knight
Posts: 2229
Joined: Sep 15, 2010 8:55 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby meign » Sep 22, 2010 10:49 am

aoas wrote:
What RIGHTS do you think animals should have?
And if like many people you're not sure about the word, please look it up before replying, so are you talking about legal rights, or saying that animals have 'natural' rights?
Or was that the wrong word to use.


I am sorry if I have used the wrong words.. All I am just after is giving animals the right to live and fell free to do things they want to do... :wink:

aoas
Vegan Talk Frequenter
Posts: 44
Joined: Sep 21, 2010 12:52 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby aoas » Sep 22, 2010 10:56 am

meign wrote:
aoas wrote:
What RIGHTS do you think animals should have?
And if like many people you're not sure about the word, please look it up before replying, so are you talking about legal rights, or saying that animals have 'natural' rights?
Or was that the wrong word to use.


I am sorry if I have used the wrong words.. All I am just after is giving animals the right to live and fell free to do things they want to do... :wink:


What about when what two animals want conflict with each other, like when animals hunt?

How much of a right to live? Should every injured animal be given medical treatment?

meign
AR Knight
Posts: 2229
Joined: Sep 15, 2010 8:55 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby meign » Sep 22, 2010 11:05 am

I don't think we can do something when two animals conflict... It's their nature.We can't just stop them, we might hurt ourselves. Maybe we can just help when we see an injured animal. :)

aoas
Vegan Talk Frequenter
Posts: 44
Joined: Sep 21, 2010 12:52 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby aoas » Sep 22, 2010 11:09 am

meign wrote:I don't think we can do something when two animals conflict... It's their nature.We can't just stop them, we might hurt ourselves. Maybe we can just help when we see an injured animal. :)


So there's no right to live then?

meign
AR Knight
Posts: 2229
Joined: Sep 15, 2010 8:55 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby meign » Sep 22, 2010 11:17 am

Still there is. :D

aoas
Vegan Talk Frequenter
Posts: 44
Joined: Sep 21, 2010 12:52 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby aoas » Sep 22, 2010 11:37 am

meign wrote:Still there is. :D


That doesn't make sense.
You're saying that they're protected and can live for as long as we can allow but at the same time they can just die.

It's like saying:
Statement 1
whilst at the same time
Not statement 1

It doesn't make any sense.

If you're interested in animal rights start off by reading some of Thomas Regan's work, and then look at the criticisms, try to prove yourself wrong about veganism.
Always be cautious of friends when you're in debates, arguments, and philosophy.

meign
AR Knight
Posts: 2229
Joined: Sep 15, 2010 8:55 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby meign » Sep 23, 2010 12:22 pm

What I am trying to say is we can protect animals as long as they are with us. We can protect them as long as they want to stay with us. That's all and nothing more:D I am not debating. I was just sharing my point of view.

aoas
Vegan Talk Frequenter
Posts: 44
Joined: Sep 21, 2010 12:52 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby aoas » Sep 23, 2010 8:50 pm

meign wrote:What I am trying to say is we can protect animals as long as they are with us. We can protect them as long as they want to stay with us. That's all and nothing more:D I am not debating. I was just sharing my point of view.


If a point of view isn't able to be scrutinised then is that view really worth having?

And that says nothing about animals in the wild, so does that mean they're open for being treated how ever...

Redsunflower
Vegan Talk Frequenter
Posts: 37
Joined: Dec 1, 2010 7:42 pm

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby Redsunflower » Dec 2, 2010 3:40 pm

Just wanted to add that on the issue of animals fighting each other in the wild...they do it for survival. No animal I've heard of will kill more creatures than it has to then eat them all at once, get really fat, create a culture of over-consumption within it's group, struggle with associated health problems and then die prematurely.

Apart from humans. :lol:

Redsunflower
Vegan Talk Frequenter
Posts: 37
Joined: Dec 1, 2010 7:42 pm

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby Redsunflower » Dec 2, 2010 4:04 pm

But back to the original quote...I think human rights and animal rights are very closely linked and that when we act to protect animals, the environment or whatever, we are protecting ourselves too. We may be acting to try and save rainforests from being destroyed to clear ground for raising cattle and producing burgers, but we're also trying to save our own ecosystem so that we can continue to live here. And less burgers would be good for humans too. It's all mixed in together somehow, for me.

Dacite
Vegan Forum Member
Posts: 105
Joined: Apr 7, 2011 9:53 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby Dacite » Apr 7, 2011 10:32 am

I just believe that there will be no peace in the world till the time people make peace with animal nations.
So the animal welfare is a priority as well as the welfare of the all living organism. Our possibility to thrive depends whether the world stay green and breathing!

User avatar
dragonfly
Vegan Talk Veteran
Posts: 213
Joined: Jul 15, 2001 12:00 am
Location: Strawberry Fields
Contact:

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby dragonfly » Apr 7, 2011 6:58 pm

WarChild wrote:I was an environmentalist back before the movement got taken over by idiots who put animal welfare above human welfare.

Jay Scott Raymond

Source: http://www.slackages.com/me/index.html

only a dull minded witless savant would say such a hopelessly stoopid thing. geeze.

slola1
Vegan Forum Visitor
Posts: 8
Joined: Apr 9, 2011 6:40 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby slola1 » Apr 9, 2011 8:36 am

Animal Rights in my opinion is simple. Animals and Humans both inhabit Earth and we should have the equal amount of right to be here as the other. Animals have the right to live their lives without us interfering with them. I wouldn't interfere with a lion hunting a gazelle for this reason: I'm not the boss of the lion, and I'm not the boss of the gazelle, they are the boss of themselves, and as such they coexist together. The Circle of Life and all that jazz. Humans just mess this cycle up. Jay Scott Raymond clearly doesn't see it this way unfortunately. :(

slola1
Vegan Forum Visitor
Posts: 8
Joined: Apr 9, 2011 6:40 am

Re: Interesting quote - what do you think about this?

Postby slola1 » Apr 9, 2011 8:38 am

WarChild wrote:I was an environmentalist back before the movement got taken over by idiots who put animal welfare above human welfare.

Jay Scott Raymond

Source: http://www.slackages.com/me/index.html



Furthuremore, he must have not got the memo that those that put human welfare above animal welfare and continue to factory farm animals without thinking twice, is destroying the environment, therefore he's a terrible environmentalist. Just saying.


 


  • RELATED_TOPICS
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Return to “Animal Rights Forum”