Vegan Talk Forums

AndyBa · Lord of the posts Joined: 27 May 2001 Posts: 670

A lot of insects and small rodents are killed during the agriculture process.

What can I answer to such an argument?
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Andy`Ba

The human body has no more need for cows' milk than it does for dogs' milk, horses' milk, or giraffes' milk. ~Michael Klaper, M.D., author of Vegan Nutrition: Pure & Simple

Jezebel · Vegan Talk Visitor Joined: 01 Jun 2001 Posts: 9

Just because you decide to become a vegetarian doesn't mean you need to change the world. A lot of non-veggies get really defensive about this issue, I think because they might feel guilty deep down. People tend to look at vegetarians as people who walk around starting fights and trying to make everyone quit eating meat when it's not like that at all. Because of them feeling this way, they try to make vegetarians feel guilty by starting these lame arguments with them. Non-meat eaters don't feel bad for the plants we eat even though they are "alive", they don't feel bad for the insects killed in the agricultural processing... the whole point of them starting those arguments is just that - to start an argument. Don't let anyone like that get to you, more than likely they could care less about the environment. They just want to make you feel guilty because you're different. You've taken a stand for animal rights. You have done something good for the environment as well as yourself. It's nobody elses business.

As for trying to argue that issue... you can't really. Like I said, just because you're a vegetarian it doesn't mean you can save the world. You can't change everything or save every species no matter how nice the thought might be. Think of how many plants, insects, rodents, small animals, and trees are completely wiped out for the use of land for cattle farming? Not only do they wipe everything out but they contaminate the soil and water with all sorts of things. And of course we can't forget the cows and their upcoming date with the butcher. You have done so much already by becoming vegetarian, but honestly I don't really no how much more one person can do. If it really bothers you that much perhaps you can grow your owns veggies? But no matter what you do, something else is going to cause suffering somewhere. We can only do so much. But even one step is better than none

Beth

[ This Message was edited by: Jezebel on 2001-06-01 15:34 ]

heath · Posted: Jun 1, 2001 7:35 pm Post subject:

What I try say to these things is that I feel I'm doing what I can. There's always going to be an argument from somebody trying to 'prove' that you're not 'really' a vegetarian/vegan/etc.

There's a feasible limit to what I can do, but I feel that I try and stand by my morals to the best of my ability. We all know people that bring up arguments like that are just trying to cause trouble...they don't care about why you're vegetarian, they just want to prove you wrong!

I also wonder if some people feel threatened by vegetarians, in a way. I think a lot of people can see some validity to vegetarianism, especially related to animal cruelty. By disproving your 'true' vegetarianism, perhaps they feel justified?

Sergio · Vegan Talk Veteran Joined: 24 May 2001 Posts: 224

Also, as is on site veganoutreach.com, we can say that we choose less suffering way. Anyway, indirectly, meat eater consumes more surfaces than vegetarian, so more insects die.

Vegan Forums Guest · Posted: Nov 30, 2001 3:23 am Post subject:

Ask the person if they REALLY care or are they just making a nuisance of themselves.

Bybo · Active Vegan Talker Joined: 08 Aug 2004 Posts: 25

I sometimes uses this.
If it really is the amount of animals that are killed that matters.
Then humans should eat whale meat.
When killing a Whale no other animals are hurt.
And whales are big, they provide most meat per kill.

I actually dont care, I dont expect you to start killing whales. I dont think its a good idea. But this shows that its not the number of animals killed that seems to matter its somehow the size of the animal and how high on some cute-i-ness scale this animal is on.
And still by not eating meat products you wont help animals because more animals are killed while a vegan/vegetarian is not eating meat.

And again its not my problem its yours. A problem in the high moral that veganism is trying to prove but in my eyes dont succed.

AndyBa · Lord of the posts Joined: 27 May 2001 Posts: 670

Bybo, whales have babies..
Do you want to knowingly leave the baby whale without his parents?..

I can't knowingly kill an animal myself, and I don't want anyone else to do it for me, that's why I'm vegan.
For me it's natural.
And since I made this choice I feel great and I never regreted it once in 14 years.
_________________
Andy`Ba

The human body has no more need for cows' milk than it does for dogs' milk, horses' milk, or giraffes' milk. ~Michael Klaper, M.D., author of Vegan Nutrition: Pure & Simple